Bill Cunningham: New York Page #2

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that will be a trend.

Hold that right there.

[Bill]

You have to do three things.

You don't get the most

information from any one.

You have to photograph

the collections.

You have to photograph

the women on the street...

who have bought the things

and how they're wearing them.

And then you have to go

to the evening events.

You can't report to the public

unless you've seen it all.

People just go off

and say what they think.

Well, it isn't really what I think.

It's what I see.

[Younger Bill] It doesn't

happen like in a day or an hour.

I go out and that's it.

I run around and photograph

all people with holes in their sneakers.

It's not that at all.

Suddenly I see something,

then I see it again,

and I think, "Ah, there's an idea,"

and other times I'll see it and I'll think,

"Wow, that's an idea,"

and then I'll look for it.

But I'll be doing ten other ideas

all at once, you see.

[Siren Chirps]

[Horn Honking]

They make the best sandwich.

And coffee... three dollars.

The cheaper the better, you know?

The coffee at the Times,

l... I... It's so... ugh.

My cord kept coming out of the

camera last night. Oh, yeah?

So I've been worried sick.

But I got something,

any rate, on that roll.

We'll see about the others.

[Interviewer] Do you know

anything about his personal life?

Nothing.

Nothing.

Absolutely nothing.

[Apfel] I don't think anybody

gets to know him very well, do they?

I have the feeling that he doesn't sit down

to talk to people too much.

[De la Renta] I have no

idea about his private life.

I have no idea if he's lonely. I have no idea...

Where does he eat dinner every night?

You have no id...

I mean, I don't.

I wonder, you know,

what he does do.

[Speaking, Indistinct]

[Woman] For all the years

that I've known Bill,

he's lived at Carnegie Hall...

in a tiny, tiny room.

You know, I once went to his studio.

Have you been there? Oh, my God.

When I saw that,

I was just, like, wow.

[Woman] File cabinets,

file cabinets, file cabinets.

He has negatives

of every picture he's ever taken.

That's my filing system.

Okay.

And this is my clothes closet.

[Interviewer And Bill Chuckling]

Does he still sleep on the cabinets?

It's just like it was

just all a little room...

with all these file cabinets

and negatives,

and that was probably

30 years ago.

I know that the bathroom

was in the hall.

[Knocking]

Editta?

[Editta]

Come in.

[Editta]

I've been here 60 years.

Carnegie Hall.

And I'm

he only one here...

except Bill on this floor,

you know.

I've done...

[Interviewer] This is fabulous.

All the stars of Hollywood.

Yes.

Well, I'm very famous.

Look at the people I've done. Look.

Tyrone Power,

Henry Fonda, Mary Martin.

Let's see.

Andy Warhol here.

You can't photograph that.

[Interviewer]

Just you.

Not this. Not Andy.

Why not?

Because not.

What do you mean you can't

photograph Andy Warhol?

Who are you kidding?

What do you mean?

That's what he was all about.

What?

Being photographed.

I just sold two to China.

This is, uh, Bernstein,

and he lived here in Carnegie Hall.

June Carter.

See, this is, uh...

You know who she is.

[Interviewer] Oh, Tilda Swinton?

Yes!

Tilda Swinton.

Swinton.

Isn't that nice? Mm-hmm.

I was here 60 years.

I'm...

I'm really a, uh, a legend now.

[Interviewer]

A legend or a fixture?

Well, I'm both,

you know what I mean?

[Interviewer]

Does Bill live next door?

[Editta]

He's down on the corner.

He's got a tiny little place, yeah.

It's nothing.

By the way,

this is Lesley Vinson,

and Lesley was the art director

of Details Magazine.

The original Details

with Annie Flanders.

We worked well together.

She took me on and didn't mind

how many changes I made...

or how many pictures

I wanted to put in.

The most extraordinary

art director.

Incredible. Um...

The love of Bill's life,

I think.

Details got started

on the ides of March 1982.

The reason I remember that date...

was it was the date that the SoHo

News went out of business.

The vision that I had for Details

was really a continuation...

of what I had been doing

at SoHo News,

discovering people and giving them

their first opportunity to be in print.

[Bill] The reason Annie founded

the magazine was to give a platform...

to the downtown,

independent, small designers,

who no one else would pay attention

to until they were successful...

and then steal them from Annie.

[Laughing]

Oh, Annie was the Earth mother

of downtown.

I don't know if that's

what you called it. Oh, definitely.

Annie would just give Bill like...

Here's a hundred pages,

and Bill flourished with Annie

more than ever anywhere.

It was like she almost gave him his own little

mini magazine just to do it however he wanted.

He'd work all day,

and he'd come up at night,

and our sessions usually lasted

till about 4:
00 in the morning.

I worked for the Establishment

during the day,

so I was like a bird getting out

of a cage, and I'd go down there.

It was marvelous.

I would come after my job

at the Times,

and we would lay this out,

and then I'd go home about 2:00.

Biked back from SoHo

where we were.

[Annie] I think one Details

Magazine, it was Fall Special...

125 pages of Bill Cunningham.

A hundred pages?

Ninety-nine.

Ninety-nine pages.

We just...

We never thought of it.

We just went on and did what we wanted

till we had said what we wanted to say.

111 pages.

111 pages.

Here what I did was I blew up

the embroidery of the coat,

and we put it on the pages,

and then put the coat, small,

in the middle of it,

'cause the news was in...

Yeah, the idea was

the big... was this.

'Cause it was like something

out of the Renaissance, you see?

You try to show the reader

what was really new.

Look at this. It's like something

from Paul Poiret, uh, 1910.

Scheherazade,

the Arabian Nights.

Look at the embroidery,

the tassels, the lace.

Now, I mean, can you imagine

the extravagance of these pages?

Annie Flanders never blinked.

You can't say anything, Annie.

I didn't take money,

so I can do what I want.

It's a wonder she didn't say,

"That didn't mean you can bankrupt me."

What I did

from the very first issue...

is I kept a list of how much

Bill would've gotten paid.

Well, the first check I sent him, he came in

the office and ceremoniously ripped it up.

The second check,

he did the same thing.

You see, if you don't take money,

they can't tell you what to do, kid.

That's... That's the key

to the whole thing.

Don't touch money.

It's the worst thing

you can do.

[Interviewer] There's a story

about the fact that Bill,

when you sold Details

to Cond Nast,

Bill refused to cash his check.

Yes.

And Si Newhouse was calling you

like every couple of months...

to say,

"Bill, your check is waiting."

Cond Nast bought it?

Yes, yes.

Newhouse bought it

a year ago.

Well, Newhouse is

taking the money.

Yeah, but they don't

own me, you see.

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