Ice Guardians Page #3

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McLelland and McSorley

away from the Oilers?

Where do you think

Wayne Gretzky would be?

Where do you think his head would be?

Wayne Gretzky was a skinny

18-year-old, 19-year-old comin' up.

And people thought,

even when he was in the WHA,

he's gonna get killed.

I believe everyone was in accord

that Wayne Gretzky should not

be injured by some person

that didn't have the same

ability as he did.

A lot of times, he'd have his back t'ya.

And if you really wanted to

put him out of the game,

it was there.

One, I wouldn't do that to a guy.

It's just not my personality.

I guess the other one might be

that I would have to deal with

the likes of Dave Semenko,

Mark Messier...

Kevin McClelland.

God knows how many other guys.

Because every one of the guys

would have been... y'know...

Wantin' to hurt ya.

I mean...

It wasn't really what I wanted

to look forward to...

everytime I played the Edmonton Oilers.

Nobody was gonna go out there

and touch Wayne Gretzky

because Dave Semenko

was gonna go after them.

Dave Semenko was going to grab them

and he was going to pound them

into the ice.

I think sometimes that I get

more credit than I deserve

for his career.

Because he was the greatest

player that ever played.

Somebody could come up and

totally blindside him when

he's not looking but...

That's probably when, myself

and some of my teammates

y'know... came into play.

There's no doubt Wayne Gretzky

woulda been a great player with

or without toughness.

But he always had toughness there.

I'm sure if you ask Gretz,

he was happy to have him...

playin' with him, many nights.

And after Dave Semenko,

you had a player like Marty McSorley.

Not only were they good enough

to play on the ice with Wayne Gretzky...

They were also good enough that

he didn't wanna go

anywhere without them.

So when Wayne Gretzky

was traded to the Kings,

Marty McSorley was part of the deal.

Not because the Kings said -

oh please give us Marty McSorley

but because Wayne Gretzky said

I'm not going anywhere without

Marty McSorley.

If the... greatest player in the game

felt that he needed to have

an enforcer with him...

That should answer all your questions.

For years after that,

a lot of star players had another guy

riding shotgun next to them.

Just to make sure nobody

took advantage of them.

Steve Yzerman, he had Bob Probert.

He had him and Joey Kocur.

Mats Sundin, he had Tie Domi there.

He had a buncha guys around

him that took care of him.

Mario Lemieux. I mean every single guy.

It made the game easier for us to play

because they were there.

You didn't see many teams

back in the 80s and 90s

that ever won a Stanley Cup

that didn't have an enforcer.

The New York Islanders...

The Philadelphia Flyers...

The Boston Bruins, the Detroit Red Wings

They maybe only had one enforcer

but they surrounded those enforcers

with some good, tough, physical players.

Followed by the superstars.

Everybody always wants to break it down

and to isolate it to one aspect

and what people don't take away

is the big picture.

It wasn't always scoring the goal

in game 7 of the Stanley Cup,

but there's a lotta games that go

to get that team in that spot.

The tough-guys were a part of that

to make your team a better team

for the long haul.

I think you would have

superstars at the levels

that they are without a doubt

if there was no enforcers.

The length of their career,

I think would be shortened.

They wouldn't be consistently

able to keep that level

throughout the season and

throughout their career.

That's why I think a lot of

these superstar guys

don't want fighting out.

They know....

if there's no fighting,

y'know, they're gonna get it

And I've seen it... happen.

I watch the game now...

Sidney Crosby has been

injured more times

from hits and head injuries and knees...

In one... year

than Gretzky in a career.

Is Sidney Crosby protected?

I don't think he is.

Wouldn't he like to be?

You can't say his...

Concussions are a direct

consequence of that.

But at the same time,

Crosby has been hit more

than any other star I've

ever seen play, so...

It's also hard to say that

it isn't because of that.

I always compare hockey to

life and business.

It's very similar.

If someone can get away with something

in life or business,

they're gonna get away with it.

Same within hockey.

If you penalize a player

or even suspend a player,

You might hurt that person

in the pocketbook

or hurt that person's team.

But, uh, if you're actually

gonna hurt the person,

it's a way bigger deterrent

than those other two things.

Some people might not wanna hear that

but, uh, it is a major, major deterrent

and it's the ultimate deterrent.

You can tell me

till you're blue in the face

that discipline and fining guys

is gonna work,

well I already knew what the fine was

for runnin' Steve Yzerman

in Detroit, if I did it.

It was Bob Probert and Joe Kocur.

And I didn't do it.

I didn't do it in Edmonton.

I didn't run at Wayne Gretzky in L.A.

I didn't let guys on my team

run at a great player.

Because I was gonna be

the guy inevitably

that was gonna pay the price.

Traditionally, the enforcer is

that shark in the water that makes sure

the skill players don't get

taken advantage of.

That's a traditional role.

It's a little more complicated now.

Fighting is very much used

as a tactical benefit.

You will find that teams often

have particular times

when they are told when is

a good time to have a fight

and when is a bad time to have a fight.

Knowing that if you don't do good,

it could be detrimental to the team.

He decked Jackson with

a couple of good left hands!

Why is intimidation effective

at changing the whole pace of a game?

Because once somebody

on your team gets hurt,

that becomes a real preoccupation.

It either makes you feel like a victim

or makes you feel like

it's time for revenge.

The adrenal level goes up.

It changes the very hormonal

"sea" on which hockey is played.

Hockey is not just played on ice...

Hockey is played on hormones.

A hockey game doesn't exist in a bubble.

You are usually either cognizant

of playing these guys before

when something could've happened.

And you're very cognizant

of playing them afterwards

where it might be a more important game

and you want to get the leg up.

How that game goes is gonna determine,

whether for the next week or month,

they are winners...

Or, hormonally and biologically,

they are "losers."

You never want them to be like

"We're playing them? Awesome!"

You want them to go -

"Oh my god, we're playin' them?"

Like, are you kidding me?

And then Flynn goes down

and takes another right hand!

You get somebody scared,

they can't do certain things.

It's almost like a deer in headlights.

They freeze.

Intimidation is really an effort

to dominate another person,

to... bring about fear

in another person,

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