The Unknown Known Page #9

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that looked at these issues,

some by civilians,

distinguished people like

Dr. Harold brown

and Dr. James Schlesinger,

former secretaries of defense,

others by military officials.

To suggest that

the procedures from Guantanamo

migrated over to Iraq

is to suggest that

the procedures in Guantanamo

would have encouraged the kind

of unbelievably bad, illegal,

improper behavior

that took place at Abu Ghraib,

and there's nothing

that would have permitted

anything like that.

Anyone who reads

the investigative reports

knows that's not the case.

This is from

the Schlesinger report.

"Changes in D.O.D.

Interrogation policies

between December 2, 2002,

and April 16, 2003,

were an element contributing

to uncertainties in the field

as to which techniques

were authorized.

Although specifically limited

by the secretary of defense

to Guantanamo, and requiring

his personal approval,

given in only two cases,

the augmented techniques

for Guantanamo

migrated to Afghanistan and Iraq

where they were neither limited

nor safeguarded."

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I think

that's a fair assessment.

Mm-hmm.

Are you saying

stuff just happens?

Well, we know that

in every war

there are things that evolve

that hadn't been planned for

or fully anticipated

and that things occur

which shouldn't occur.

Wouldn't it have been

better not to go there at all?

Well, I guess time will tell.

Barack Obama opposed

most of the structures

that president George W. Bush

put in place:

Guantanamo bay, the concept

of indefinite detention,

the patriot act,

military commissions.

Here we are, years later,

and they're all still there.

I think that kind of has to

validate, to some extent,

the decisions that were made

by president George W. Bush.

We went to Bethesda

and Walter Reed

a great many times.

The strength that you felt

from the families

and the people wounded

was just absolutely

an inspiration.

It was an intensive care unit.

The doctor said,

"this guy's not gonna make it."

We walked in, met the man,

talked to him,

talked to the family.

I don't know what the word is.

But the family...

the wife said,

"I know he'll make it."

I think it was probably

two, three, four weeks later

I went back, and sure as heck,

the doctor said he made it.

Unbelievable.

So we're

a very fortunate country,

and the good lord willing,

we won't have

to be engaged in wars,

but I'm afraid,

human nature being what it is,

that we'll have to continue

to ask young men and women

to come and serve our country,

and their lives will be at risk.

When you're in a position

like secretary of defense,

do you feel that you actually

are in control of history

or that history

is controlling you?

Oh, neither.

Obviously,

you don't control history,

and you are failing

if history controls you.

Are you surprised

when you go back

and read these memos?

Oh, my goodness, yes.

I can't believe

some of the things I wrote.

I don't know where

all those words came from.

"February 4, 2004.

Subject:
What you know.

There are knowns knowns.

There are known unknowns.

There are unknown unknowns.

But there are also

unknown knowns.

That is to say,

things that you think you know

that it turns out

you did not."

If you take those words

and try to connect them

in each way that is possible...

There was at least

one more combination

that wasn't there:

The unknown knowns.

Things that

you possibly may know

that you don't know you know.

But the memo doesn't say that.

It says we know less,

not more, than we think we do.

Is that right?

I reversed it?

Put it up again.

Let me see.

"There are also unknown knowns.

That is to say,

things that you think you know

that it turns out you did not."

Yeah, I think that memo

is backwards.

I think that it's closer

to what I said here than that.

Unknown knowns.

I think you're probably, Errol,

chasing the wrong rabbit here.

As ubiquitous

as those suicide bombers

have become in Iraq, far more

people are now being killed

by executions

than by those bombings.

Another 40 bodies today dumped

on the streets of Baghdad,

tortured.

But with

an especially deadly October

and Iraq tipping toward chaos...

the U.S. is on

the brink of failure in Iraq.

A parade of generals called

Rumsfelds war strategy flawed.

The democrats are in;

Donald Rumsfeld is out.

Firing secretary of

defense Donald Rumsfeld

and replacing him with a veteran

of his father's administration.

Mr. President,

thank you for your kind words.

The great respect that I have

for your leadership

in this little-understood,

unfamiliar war,

the first war

of the 21st century.

It is not well known.

It was not well understood.

It is complex for people

to comprehend.

And I know with certainty

that, over time,

the contributions you've made

will be recorded by history.

Thank you.

Mr. secretary.

This way.

"December 15, 2006.

To:
Pentagon personnel.

From:
Donald Rumsfeld.

Subject:
'Snowflakes...

the blizzard is over.'

over the past six years,

thousands of these memos

have fallen,

sometimes in blizzards,

and sometimes in cold

and lonely isolation.

Yet, as surprising

as this may seem

to those who may have been

buried in the deluge,

there are many people

in the department

who have never received

a snowflake.

This snowflake

is especially for them.

Its message is, perhaps

typically, to the point.

Thank you.

The blizzard is over."

One last question.

Why are you doing this?

Why are you talking to me?

That is a vicious question.

I'll be darned if I know.

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