Judgment at Nuremberg Page #4

He was always a man of great intelligence.

He was a man born with the qualities

of a great legal mind.

Would you tell us

from your own experience...

the position of the judge in Germany

prior to the advent of Adolf Hitler.

The position of the judge

was one of complete independence.

Now, would you describe

the contrast, if any...

after the coming to power

of National Socialism in ?

Judges became subject

to something outside of objective justice.

They became subject to what was necessary

for the protection of the country.

Would you explain this, please?

The first consideration of the judge...

became the punishment of acts

against the state...

rather than objective consideration

of the case.

And what other changes were there?

The right to appeal was eliminated.

The Supreme Court of the Reich

was replaced by...

People's and Special Courts.

The concept of race

was made a legal concept for the first time.

And what was the result of this?

The result?

The result was

to hand over the administration of justice...

into the hands of the dictatorship.

Now, Dr. Wieck...

Col. Lawson, I would like

to ask a few questions.

Did the judiciary protest these laws

abridging their independence?

A few of them did.

Those who did resigned,

or were forced to resign.

Others adapted themselves

to the new situation.

Do you think the judiciary was aware

of the consequences to come?

At first, perhaps not.

Later it became clear to anyone

who had eyes and ears.

Thank you.

Now, would you please describe for us

the changes in criminal law?

It was characterized by...

an ever-increasing inflation

of the death penalty.

Sentences were passed

against defendants...

just because they were Poles, or Jews,

or politically undesirable.

Novel National Socialist measures

were introduced.

Among them...

sexual sterilization for those

who were categorized as asocial.

Did it become necessary for judges...

to wear any distinctive mark

on their robes in ?

The so-called Fuehrer's Decree...

required judges to wear the insignia

of the swastika on their robes.

- Did you wear such an insignia?

- No.

I would have been ashamed to wear it.

Did you resign in ?

Yes, sir.

Did Ernst Janning wear a swastika

on his robe?

Yes.

That's all. Thank you.

Herr Rolfe.

You used the phrase, "What was necessary

for the protection of the country."

Will you explain for the tribunal...

the conditions in Germany at the time

National Socialism came to power?

What conditions?

Would you say

there was widespread hunger?

Yes.

Would you say there was internal disunity?

Yes.

Was there a Communist Party?

Yes.

Was it the third-largest party in Germany?

Yes.

Would you say...

that National Socialism helped to cure

some of these conditions?

Yes, but at a terrible price...

Please confine yourself

to answering the questions only.

Therefore, was it not possible

that a judge might wear a swastika...

and yet work for what he thought was best

for his country?

No. It was not possible.

You were not in the administration...

from the years to ...

by your own admission.

Is it not possible

that your view of the administration...

might be distorted?

No. It is not.

How can you testify about

what was going on in the administration...

if you were not there?

I had many friends

in the legal administration.

There were journals and books.

From journals and books?

I see.

You referred to:

"Novel National Socialist

measures introduced...

"among them sexual sterilization."

Are you aware that sexual sterilization

was not invented by National Socialism...

but had been advanced for years before

as a weapon...

in dealing with the mentally incompetent

and the criminal?

Yes. I am aware of that.

Are you aware that it has advocates

among leading citizens in other countries?

I am not an expert on such laws.

Then permit me to read one to you.

This is a High Court opinion...

upholding such laws in existence

in another country.

And I quote:

"We have seen more than once

that the public welfare...

"may call upon the best citizens

for their lives.

"It would be strange indeed,

if it could not call upon those...

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