My Dinner with Andre Page #6

when I brought it home.

So I went down to meet this flag maker

that I'd heard about.

And you know, there was

this very straightforward-looking guy.

You know, very sweet, really healthy-looking

and everything. Nice big, blond.

And he had a beautiful, clean loft

down in the village with lovely, happy flags.

And I was all into The Little Prince,

and I talked to him about The Little Prince...

...these adventures and everything, how I

needed the flag and what the flag should be.

He seemed to really connect with it.

So, two weeks later, I came back.

He showed me a flag that I thought

was very odd, you know...

'cause I had, you know...

well, you know...

I had expected something

gentle and lyrical.

There was something about this

that was so powerful...

...it was almost overwhelming.

And it did include the Tibetan swastika.

He put a swastika in your flag?

No, it was the Tibetan swastika,

not the Nazi swastika.

It's one of the most ancient

Tibetan symbols.

And it was just strange, you know?

But I brought it home,

because my idea with this flag...

...was that before I left...

you know, before I left for India...

I wanted several people who were close to me

to have this flag in the room for the night...

...to sleep with it, you know, and then

in the morning to sew something into the flag.

So I took the flag into Marina, and I said,

"Hey, look at this. What do you think of this?"

And she said, " What is that? That's awful. "

I said, " It's a flag. "

And she said, " I don't like it. "

I said, " I kind of thought you might like

to spend the night with it, you know. "

But she really thought

the flag was awful.

So then Chiquita threw this party

for me before I left for India...

...and the apartment

was filled with guests.

And at one point Chiquita said,

"The flag, the flag. Where's the flag?"

And I said, " Oh, yeah. The flag. "

And I go and get the flag, and I open it up.

Chiquita goes absolutely white

and runs out of the room and vomits.

So the party just comes to a halt

and breaks up.

And then the next day

I gave it to this young woman...

...who'd been in my group in Poland,

who was now in New York.

I didn't tell her anything

about any of this.

At 5:
00 in the morning,

she called me up and she said...

"I gotta come and see you right away. "

I thought, " Oh, God. "

She came up, and she said, " I saw things...

I saw things around this flag.

"Now, I know you're stubborn, and I know

you want to take this thing with you...

"but if you'd follow my advice,

you'd put it in a hole in the ground...

...and burn it and cover it with earth,

cause the devil's in it. "

I never took the flag with me.

In fact, I gave it to her, and, uh,

she... She had a ceremony with it...

...six months later, in France,

with some friends...

...in which, uh, they did burn it.

God.

That's really, really amazing.

So, did you ever go to India?

Oh, yes, I... I went to India

in the spring, Wally...

...and I came back home

feeling all wrong.

I mean, you know, I'd been to India,

and I'd just felt like a tourist.

I'd found nothing.

So I was... I was spending, uh, the summer

on Long Island with my family...

...and I heard about this community

in Scotland called Findhorn...

...where people sang and talked

and meditated with plants.

And it was founded by several rather

middle-class English and Scottish eccentrics.

Some of them intellectuals,

and some of them not.

And I'd heard that they'd

grown things in soil...

...that supposedly nothing can grow in,

'cause it's almost beach soil...

...and that they'd built... Not built... They'd

grown the largest cauliflowers in the world...

...and there are sort of cabbages.

And they've grown trees

that can't grow in the British Isles.

So I went there.

I mean, it is an amazing place, Wally.

I mean, if there are insects

bothering the plants...

...they will talk with the insects

and, you know, make an agreement...

...by which they'll set aside a special patch

of vegetables just for the insects...

...and then the insects

will leave the main part alone.

- Huh.

- Things like that.

And everything they do

they do beautifully.

I mean, the buildings just shine.

And I mean, for instance, the icebox,

the stove, the car... They all have names.

And since you wouldn't treat Helen,

the icebox...

...with any less respect

than you would Margaret, your wife...

...you know, you make sure that Helen is as clean

as Margaret, or treated with equal respect.

And when I was there, Wally,

I remember being in the woods...

...and I would look at a leaf,

and I would actually see that thing...

...that is alive in that leaf.

And then I remember just running

through the woods as fast as I could...

...with this incredible laugh

coming out of me...

...and really being in that state,you know,

where laughter and tears seem to merge.

I mean, it absolutely blasted me open.

When I came out of Findhorn,

I was hallucinating nonstop.

I was seeing clouds as creatures.

The people on the airplane

all had animals' faces.

I mean, I was on a trip. It was like being

in a William Blake world suddenly.

Things were exploding.

So immediately I went to Belgrade,

'cause I wanted to talk to Grotowski.

Grotowski and I got together

at midnight in my hotel room...

...and we drank instant coffee

out of the top of my shaving cream...

...and we talked from midnight

until 11:
00 the next morning.

- God. What did he say?

- Nothing!

I talked. He didn't say a word.

And...And then I guess really...

...the last big experience of this kind

took place that fall.

It was out at Montauk on Long Island...

...and there were only about nine

of us involved, mostly men.

And we borrowed Dick Avedon's property

out at Montauk.

And the country out there

is like Heathcliff country.

It's absolutely wild.

What we wanted to do was

we wanted to take, you know...

We wanted to take All Souls' Eve,

Halloween...

...and use it as a point of departure

for something.

So each one of us prepared

some sort of event for the others...

...somehow in the spirit

of All Souls' Eve.

But the biggest event

was three of the people...

...kept disappearing

in the middle of the night each night...

...and we knew they were

preparing something big...

...but we didn't know what.

And midnight on Halloween,

under a dark moon, above these cliffs...

...we were all told to gather at the topmost cliff

and that we would be taken somewhere.

And we did.

And we waited, and it was very, very cold.

And then the three of them... Helen, Bill

and Fred... Showed up wearing white.

You know, something they'd made out

of sheets... Looked a little spooky, not funny.

And they took us into the basement of this house

that had burned down on the property.

And in this ruined basement, they had set up

a table with benches they'd made.

And on this table they had laid out paper,

pencils, wine and glasses.

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