My Dinner with Andre Page #8

this show about Billie Holiday.

I looked at these show business people who

know nothing about Billie Holiday, nothing.

You see, they were really kind of,

in a way, intellectual creeps.

And I suddenly had this feeling. I mean, you know I

was just sitting there, crying through most of the show.

And I suddenly had this feeling

I was just as creepy as they were...

...and that my whole life

had been a sham...

...and I didn't have the guts

to be Billie Holiday either.

I mean, I really feel

that I'm just washed up, wiped out.

I feel I've just squandered my life.

Andr, now, how can you say

something like that?

I mean...

Well, you know, I may be in

a very emotional state right now, Wally...

...but since I've come back home I've just

been finding the world we're living in...

...more and more upsetting.

I mean, last week I went down

to the Public Theater one afternoon.

You know, when I walked in,

I said hello to everybody...

'cause I know them all, and they all know me,

they're always very friendly.

You know that seven or eight people

told me how wonderful I looked?

And then one person... One... A woman

who runs the casting office, said...

"Gee, you look horrible.

Is something wrong?"

Now, she...You know, we started talking.

Of course, I started telling her things.

And she suddenly burst into tears

because an aunt of hers who's 80...

...whom she's very fond of, went into

the hospital for a cataract, which was solved.

But the nurse was so sloppy,

she didn't put the bed rails up...

...and so the aunt fell out of bed

and is now a complete cripple.

So you know, we were talking

about hospitals.

Now, you know, this woman,

because of who she is...

You know, 'cause this had happened

to her very, very recently.

- She could see me with complete clarity.

- Uh-huh.

She didn't know anything

about what I'd been going through.

But the other people, what they saw

was this tan, or this shirt...

...or the fact that the shirt

goes well with the tan.

So they said, " Gee, you look wonderful. "

Now, they're living

in an insane dreamworld.

They're not looking.

That seems very strange to me.

Right, because they just didn't

see anything, somehow...

...except, uh, the few little things

that they wanted to see.

Yeah, you know, it's like what happened

just before my mother died.

You know, we'd gone to the hospital

to see my mother...

...and I went in to see her...

...and I saw this woman who looked as bad

as any survivor of Auschwitz or Dachau.

And I was out in the hall

sort of comforting my father...

...when a doctor who was a specialist

in a problem she had with her arm...

...went into her room

and came out just beaming.

And he said, " Boy, don't we have

a lot of reason to feel great?

Isn't it wonderful

how she's coming along?"

Now, all he saw was the arm.

That's all he saw.

Now, here's another person

who's existing in a dream.

Who, on top of that,

is a kind of butcher...

...who's committing

a kind of familial murder...

...because when he comes out of that room,

he psychically kills us...

...by taking us into a dream world...

...where we become confused

and frightened...

'cause the moment before,

we saw somebody who already looked dead...

...and now here comes a specialist

who tells us they're in wonderful shape.

I mean, they were literally

driving my father crazy.

I mean, you know, here's an 82-year-old man

who's very emotional...

...and you know, and if you go in one moment,

and you see the person's dying...

...and you don't want them to die, and then

a doctor comes out five minutes later...

...and tells you they're in wonderful shape...

I mean, you know, you can go crazy.

- Yeah. I know what you mean.

- I mean, the doctor didn't see my mother.

The people at the Public Theater

didn't see me.

I mean, we're just walking around

in some kind of fog.

I think we're all in a trance.

We're walking around like zombies.

I don't... I don't think we're even aware

of ourselves or our own reaction to things.

We...We're just going around all day

like unconscious machines...

...and meanwhile there's all of this rage

and worry and uneasiness...

...just building up

and building up inside us.

That's right. It just builds up, uh...

...and then it just leaps out

inappropriately.

I mean, I remember

when I was, uh, acting in this play...

...based on The Master and Margarita

by Bulgakov.

And I was playing the part of the cat.

But they had trouble, uh,

making up my cat suit...

...so I didn't get it delivered to me

till the night of the first performance.

Particularly the head... I mean,

I'd never even had a chance to try it on.

And about four of my fellow actors

actually came up to me...

...and they said these things

which I just couldn't help thinking...

...were attempts to destroy me.

You know, one of them said, uh,

"Oh, well, now that head...

"will totally change your hearing

in the performance.

"You may hear everything

completely differently...

"and it may be very upsetting.

"Now, I was once in a performance

where I was wearing earmuffs...

...and I couldn't hear anything

anybody said. "

And then another one said, " Oh, you know,

whenever I wear even a hat on stage...

I tend to faint. "

I mean, those remarks

were just full of hostility...

...because, I mean, if I'd listened to those people,

I would have gone out there on stage...

...and I wouldn't have been able to hear anything,

and I would have fainted.

But the hostility

was completely inappropriate...

...because, in fact,

those people liked me.

I mean, that hostility was just

some feeling that was, you know...

...left over from

some previous experience.

Because somehow

in our social existence today...

...we're only allowed to

express our feelings, uh...

...weirdly and indirectly.

If you express them directly,

everybody goes crazy.

Well, did you express your feelings

about what those people said to you?

No. I mean, I didn't even know

what I felt till I thought about it later.

And I mean, at the most, you know,

in a situation like that, uh...

...even if I had known what I felt...

I might say something,

if I'm really annoyed...

...like, uh, " Oh, yeah.

Well, that's just fascinating...

...and, uh, I probably will

faint tonight,just as you did. "

I do just the same thing myself.

We can't be direct, so we end up

saying the weirdest things.

I mean, I remember a night. It was

a couple of weeks after my mother died.

And I was in pretty bad shape.

And I had dinner with three

relatively close friends...

...two of whom had

known my mother quite well...

...and all three of whom

had known me for years.

You know that we went through that

entire evening without my being able to...

...for a moment,

get anywhere near what...

Not that I wanted to sit

and have this dreary evening...

...in which I was talking about all this pain

that I was going through and everything.

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