Searching for Sugar Man Page #4

I just smelt a dirty money story

somewhere there.

So, if you compare to other artists,

how big was it actually?

Every month it just sold.

And every party you went to

and every place you went to,

you'd hear that album at least once.

I don't think I could even think

of how many albums he's sold here

'cause it's a long period of time.

What could be probable?

I'd have to guess. Maybe half a million

copies over that period of time.

It's a lot of records,

especially for a small country.

Gold record, ten times over.

Rodriguez never got

to know that he was big in South Africa.

How could that be?

Don't know.

I mean, everything would have been...

I find that strange.

I have no idea.

But you must have sent

royalties somewhere?

Of course we sent royalties.

We sent royalties to A&M Records.

I remember the label. It was A&M Sussex.

Whether they had a partnership,

whatever they had, I don't... You know.

So, my suggestion is, if you

can find out whoever the person was

who owned Sussex Records,

then you will find out

what happened to the money.

Because it's weird, isn't it?

It's very strange. Very strange.

How popular was the album?

Was he as famous as,

you know,

the Rolling Stones and the Doors?

Oh, it was much bigger

than Rolling Stones.

Absolutely, at the time, yeah.

When you released

the record, did you try to contact him?

No, not at all. You know?

Because... because, at the time,

the legend... the legend was...

here was an artist.

This was like Jimi Hendrix.

With Jimi Hendrix catalogues,

you've gotta understand,

if you just got Jimi Hendrix and you'd

got the license for this territory,

you're obviously not gonna go try get

hold of Jimi Hendrix, because he's dead.

- But who did you pay royalties to?

- To Sussex Music.

To Clarence?

Yes. Well, to Sussex Music

which is his company, yeah.

So, I decided to make a diagram.

Write down the whole path

and trail that I was trying to work out.

All the various touch points,

all the record companies,

all the people that had dealings with

Rodriguez and his album at some point.

I made this whole document.

So I found out there were three

record companies in South Africa

that had released Rodriguez's records.

Finally discovering that

led to a record company in America.

It was a company that

had been signing Rodriguez

and creating his first album

called Sussex.

I then did my research on Sussex.

That led me to discovering

who the owner of Sussex Records was:

Clarence Avant.

Clarence Avant,

he'd been the head of Motown,

one of the most prestigious jobs

to have in the record company industry.

So I did my research. I tried everything

to get a hold of Clarence Avant,

but I just got to a lot of closed doors.

I could not get a hold of him.

I don't know

if you've ever seen this picture.

That's him.

That's Rodriguez.

I don't know when this was made.

I have absolutely no idea.

- That's 1970, I think.

- Yeah.

This is my man.

Man, don't get me emotional again. Sh*t.

You made me emotional once.

I ain't getting emotional no more

sitting here talking to you, man.

If I had to name ten artists

that I have ever been involved with,

Rodriguez would be in the top five,

simple as that.

There's nothing...

You never heard anything like him.

People would say, "Well, Bob Dylan."

I said, "No, no".

Bob Dylan was mild to this guy.

Did it make any money?

We judge singing here in America...

If you say,

"Is it... Was it the top hundred?

"Was it... was it number...

Did it get on the charts as number 12?

"Was there a lot of radio play?"

The answer's, "No, man."

Nobody didn't... Rodriguez?

You know, that name didn't register.

Although he looked like he was

a white guy but, even still, Rodriguez,

everybody knew Rodriguez,

that's a Spanish name.

A Latin name.

Latin music was not happening then.

How many records do you think

he sold in America?

In America'? Six.

Maybe my wife bought it,

maybe my daughter bought...

She couldn't buy it, but maybe

Neil Bogart, maybe Dennis and Mike.

Hey, look, man, you know,

it didn't sell here.

There was some excitement about him.

Couple of agents heard him

and wanted to bring him to California

and, you know, when he came

to California he was nervous,

and he turned his back to the audience

and everybody said,

"Well, what the hell is this?"

But the thing is that the guy sold

hundreds of thousands of records

in another country.

I'm going to South Africa to try

to chase somebody who's selling records?

Sh*t, no, man.

But did you know

that he was big in South Africa?

Rodriguez, young man, never happened

insofar as I'm concerned.

Period.

But if I'm really gonna try to track

down the money, how should I do it?

Well, is that important, the money?

Or is Rod...

Which is important? Rodriguez's story

or you worrying about the money?

How many people in South Africa?

Well, so they've been freed

for how long? Three hours?

So what the f***'s

that supposed to mean?

You told me at lunch,

they scratch records

because they wouldn't let the lyrics...

So the underground movement,

how big was it'? How big was it?

He sold half a million records

in South Africa.

So he sold half a million records.

So what?

I don't know who he sold them to.

How many distributors did he have?

I have no idea.

There are only...

There are three record labels.

- I spoke to all the record label...

- Well, great.

...bosses in South Africa who

has released his records. It was...

Go back to 'em and tell 'em

to send me an account.

You think it's something

I'm gonna worry about, a 1970 contract?

If you do,

you're outta your goddamn mind.

Buddha Records out of business.

I'm out of business.

So you think they give a sh*t

about that? I know I wouldn't.

I've been looking for information

about Rodriguez for a long time.

I've even setup a web page

called The Great Rodriguez Hunt

in the hope that

someone out there in cyberspace

would post a message on the forum giving

us any information about Rodriguez.

But there was nothing.

At that stage I met Craig,

who was the musicologist detective

who had read my liner notes

and who was also

searching for Rodriguez.

And he flew down to Cape Town

and we met in a coffee shop.

And we exchanged

all the information we had.

But unfortunately we had very little.

And at that stage I remember we felt

it was probably best if we just stopped.

So basically I was lost.

I'd come to a dead end.

I couldn't find him.

I didn't know where to look any more.

I'd even visited the places

that he sang about.

I'd been to London. Nothing.

I'd been to Amsterdam.

He sings about Amsterdam. Nothing.

And one day I'd basically given up.

I thought, "Well, this is it. "

And one day, just by accident,

I was listening to the album in the car

and I heard the song Inner City Blues.

Great song. And the line came up.

"I met a girl in Dearborn,

early six o'clock this morn.

"A cold fact."

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