Shoah Page #5

[ Borowi Continues ]

Sometimes the Ukrainians

fired through the car walls.

[ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

It happened chiefly at night.

When the Jews talked to each other,

as he showed us,

the Ukrainians wanted things quiet,

and they asked...

yes, asked them to shut up.

So the Jews shut up

and the guard moved off.

Then the Jews started talking again,

in their language,

as he says, ra-ra-ra, and so on.

What's he mean, la-la-la?

What's he trying to imitate?

- Their language.

- No, ask him.

Was the Jews' noise something special?

- They spoke Jew.

- [ Repeats Phrase]

Oui.

- Does Mr. Borowi understand Jew?

- [ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

No.

[Train Clacking ]

[ Bomba, In English]

We were in that wagon.

The wagon was rolling, rolling

in the direction east.

A funny thing happened right there.

Maybe it's not nice to say,

but I will say it.

Most of the people, not only most,

but 99% of the Polish people,

when they saw the train going through...

We looked really like animals in that wagon,

just our eyes looked outside.

And they were laughing,

and they were all...

They had a joy,

because they took the Jewish people away.

What was going on in the wagon

between the people,

and the pushing and the screaming...

Where is my child?

and, Where is my this?

and A little bit Of water!

And people were not only starving,

but they were choking.

It was hot.

It happened... Just it happened...

The Jewish luck...

in September, at that time,

usually when it is rainy, when it is cool,

that it was hot like hell.

We had nothing inside.

For a child, you know, like my own child

about the age of three weeks,

there was not a drop of water.

There wasn't a drop of water for the mother,

but there wasn't a drop of water for anybody else.

[Whistle Blows]

[ Lanzmann, In French]

Did he hear screams behind his locomotive?

[Whistle Blows]

[ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

[ Man Replies In Polish ]

Obviously, since the locomotive

was next to the camp.

They screamed, asked for water.

[ Man Continues]

The screams from the cars

closest to the locomotive

could be heard very well.

[ Lanzmann ]

Can one get used to that?

[ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

[ Man Replies ]

No.

[ Man Continues]

It was extremely distressing to him.

He knew that the people behind him

were human, like him.

- [Whistle Blows]

- [Man Continues]

The Germans gave him

and the other workers vodka to drink.

Without drinking,

they couldn't have done it.

[ Man Continues]

There was a bonus...

[ Man Continues]

that they were paid

not in money, but in liquor.

[ Man Continues]

Those who worked on other trains

didn't get this bonus.

[Whistle Blows]

HENRIK GAWKOWSKI

He drank every drop he got

because without liquor

he couldn't stand the stench

when he got here.

They even bought more liquor

on their own

to get drunk on.

[ Bomba ]

We arrived in the morning.

We arrived, I would say,

about 6:
00, maybe 6:30.

On the other side of the tracks,

I saw more trains standing there,

and I was watching through...

I saw about 18, 20, maybe more,

wagons going away.

And after about an hour or so,

I saw the wagons coming back,

but without the people.

My train stayed there until about 12:00.

[ Lanzmann ] From the station

to the unloading ramp in the camp,

how many miles?

[ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

Four.

[ Bomba ] While we stayed there,

at that station over there,

waiting to go in Treblinka camp,

some of those German SS,

they came around,

and they were asking us what we have.

So we said, We got...

Some of the people, they have, uh, gold.

They have diamonds.

But we want water.

So they said, Good.

Give us the diamonds,

we bring you water.

Yeah, they took away.

They didn't bring any water at all.

[ Lanzmann, In English]

How long did last the trip?

The trip lasted

from Czestochowa to Treblinka

about 24 hours,

with interruption waiting in Warsaw

and also waiting at Treblinka

to go into Treblinka.

ABRAHAM BOM BA:

At the last train, we went in over there.

But, like I mentioned before,

I saw many trains coming back,

but the trains were without the people.

So I said to myself,

What happened to the people?

We don't see any people,

just trains coming back.

[Train Clacking ]

[ Glazar, In German]

We traveled for two days.

On the morning of the second day

we saw that

we had left Czechoslovakia

and were heading east.

[Train Whistle Blows]

It wasn't the SS guarding us,

but the Schutzpolizei,

the police, in green uniforms.

We were in ordinary passenger cars.

All the seats were filled.

You c0uldn't choose.

They were all numbered and assigned.

In my compartment

there was an elderly couple.

I still remember:

The good man was always hungry

and his wife scolded him,

saying the y'd have no food lefi

for the future.

RICHARD GLAZAR:

[Whistle Blows]

Then, on the second day,

I saw a sign for Malkinia.

We went on a little farther.

Then, very slowly,

the train turned off the main track

and rolled at' a walking pace

through a wood.

While he looked out,

we'd been able to open a window.

The old man

in our compartment saw a boy...

Cows were grazing...

And he asked the boy in signs,

Where are we?

And the kid made a funny gesture. This!

Across the throat.

- [ Lanzmann, In German ] A Pole?

- A Pole.

Where was this? At the station?

It was where the train had stopped.

On one side was the wood,

and on the other were fields.

And there was a farmer in a field?

We saw cows

watched over by a young man,

a farmhand.

And one of you questioned him?

Not in words, but in signs, we asked,

What's going on here?

And he made that gesture. Like this.

We didn't really

pay much attention to him.

We couldn't figure out what he meant.

[ Dog Barking ]

[ Man Speaking Polish]

[ Interpreter #1, In French]

Once there were foreign Jews...

They were this fat...

[ Lanzmann, In French]

This fat?

[ Interpreter #1 ]

Riding in passenger cars.

There was a dining car,

they could drink

and walk around, too.

They said they were going to a factory.

On arrival, they saw

what kind of a factory it was.

[ Men Speaking Polish]

We'd gesture...

- [ Lanzmann ] Gesture how?

- [ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

That they'd be killed.

[ Lanzmann ]

These people made that sign?

He says the Jews didn't believe it.

[ Lanzmann ]

But what does that gesture mean?

[ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

That death awaited them.

The people who had a chance

to get near the Jews

did that to warn them...

- [ Lanzmann ] He did it too?

- That they'd be hanged, killed, slain.

[ Interpreter #1 Speaking Polish]

Yes.

Even foreign Jews

from Belgium, Czechoslovakia,

from France too, surely.

And from Holland...

These didn't know,

but the Polish Jews knew.

In the small cities in the area,

it was talked about.

So the Polish Jews were forewarned,

but not the others.

Who'd they warn,

Polish Jews or the others?

All the Jews.

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